Discussion:
Multi Library support in LMS 7.9
mherger
2014-06-11 15:31:58 UTC
Permalink
A little heads-up to you brave beta testers: I'm going to merge a major
change which will add infrastructure for multi library support to LMS
7.9. See http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=101589 for some
of the discussion.

What is it?


- "Virtual Libraries" (or filtered views on your library) will be
available from the My Music menu item. Once you select such a library,
you'll have a filtered view on your collection. This means you could
eg. have only Kids music in the kid's room Radio, and none of that
stuff on your Transporter, or have FLAC files listed only.
- Plugins can register their own virtual libraries. They'll have to
implement a scanner module to provide the necessary data to the browse
modes. This can be as simple as an SQL statement running after the
main scan. There's a LibraryDemo plugin which shows developers how it
can be done.
- Plugins can register custom menu items based on a virtual library.
This would allow you to get a very specific view on your collection
without having to switch to a filtered view for the remainder of the
menus. The LibraryDemo does this to add a few items dealing with long
tracks.


Some caveats:


- After you update your LMS 7.9 to the latest and greatest LMS will
automatically run a wipe & rescan, as the DB schema has changed.
- LMS only provides the infrastructure to achieve all of this. Plus a
LibraryDemo plugin which shows a few possibilities. It's up to 3rd
parties to make this a rally great feature.
- The LibraryDemo plugin is disabled by default. If you want to test
these new features you'll have to to enable it and re-run a scan.
- 3rd party plugins dealing with the music library will require work
to support filtered views (eg. SmartMix ;-))
- RandomPlay needs some good testing. I did update it to support
virtual libraries. But this required more changes than I expected.
- This is still work in progress. The most important changes should be
done already. But I'm sure I've forgotten many of the small details. A
lot of code in the area of library browsing has changed. Please test,
test, test, and report any issues you're seeing.
- Bit OUCH!: most smartphone apps aren't ready for the filtered view
yet (custom filter menu items should work). In some cases it'll
require serious work by the developer, in other cases it might be a
simple caching problem. Please get in touch with me if you are a
developer. We'll figure this out.



Michael

http://www.herger.net/slim-plugins - MusicArtistInfo, MusicInfoSCR,
Smart Mix
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pippin
2014-06-11 17:13:44 UTC
Permalink
One thing I don't understand and which is currently between me and a
good iPeng support for this: how is the usage model for this supposed to
look like?

If you think purely player-centric as in SqueezePlay I can kind of get
it but the Squeezebox system, after all, is also a multiroom system so
you need some way to handle that.

How is this supposed to look like? Is this like different servers all
with their respective players?
How do I know which player belongs to which virtual server?
Is there a way to learn about these assignments?
How do I switch players between them?
What about MySB?

At least in iPeng, all main menus are NOT player-specific (the caching
effort for people with lots of players and/or large libraries would
probably be prohibitive) so to get this usable we need some kind of user
model of how this whole thing is supposed to work.



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Roland0
2014-06-11 17:27:07 UTC
Permalink
Does this result in any
- CLI/JSON API changes
- server API changes (e.g. in Slim::Schema)
?



[ extGUI4LMS - an alternative web interface: 'forum'
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pippin
2014-06-11 18:23:02 UTC
Permalink
Hm, how do I enable this? I pulled the latest 7.9 changes and the
commit message says it includes the "LibraryDemo" plugin but I can't see
it anywhere? Am I missing something?



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Logitech UE Smart Radio as well as iPeng Party, the free Party-App,
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*New: iPeng 7, the Universal App for iOS 7*
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pippin
2014-06-11 18:43:18 UTC
Permalink
OK, the plugin works although it's shown nowhere in the plugin list....
Whenever the server is finished looking up artwork, I'll look into it
some more.
Has there been some change to the image lookup (albums and artists)?
Each image seems to take like 10s or so for me and since I seem to have
1.200 artists (with a test library of only 5000 tracks) this can take a
while.
Is there something broken with artists/albums/whatever counts or the
scanner?

OK, this is probably OT here, will report back when I looked at how the
plugin works.



---
learn more about iPeng, the iPhone and iPad remote for the Squeezebox
and
Logitech UE Smart Radio as well as iPeng Party, the free Party-App,
at penguinlovesmusic.com
*New: iPeng 7, the Universal App for iOS 7*
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get.amped
2014-06-11 20:09:28 UTC
Permalink
Will this potentially be a way to circumvent the 100K track limitation
with the Smart Mix plugin? Seems like I should be able to create a
filtered library that would contain most of the "good" stuff based on
bitrate, genre, year range, etc.



Win7Pro(x64)[3.3Ghz i5, 8GB RAM, 120GB SSD system, 15TB storage], LMS
7.9.0 -> Logitech Squeezebox Classic V.3 -> Cambridge Audio DacMagic ->
NAD C160 -> 2 x NAD C272 -> Quad 22L2
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Michael Herger
2014-06-11 21:11:37 UTC
Permalink
> Will this potentially be a way to circumvent the 100K track limitation
> with the Smart Mix plugin? Seems like I should be able to create a
> filtered library that would contain most of the "good" stuff based on
> bitrate, genre, year range, etc.

Yes, that's definitely a use case I was thinking about today myself. But first things first.
local.bin
2014-06-11 21:30:12 UTC
Permalink
Will this conflict with Erlands multi library plugin if we already have
that installed with 7.9?

Is it meant to be a replacement, or work with it.

Thanks


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Michael Herger
2014-06-12 03:23:12 UTC
Permalink
> Will this conflict with Erlands multi library plugin if we already have
> that installed with 7.9?

I don't think so. Unless you install a plugin making use of those new
features there should be no change in behaviour at all. It's totally
optional. Most of what I implemented was suggested by Erland (thanks!).
I'm pretty sure he'd let me know quickly if I messed up his plugins.

I'd rather expect him to take advantage of these changes. He's asked me
to do them for good reason I must assume ;-).

> Is it meant to be a replacement, or work with it.

The changes I committed really are mostly "infrastructure": they allow a
plugin to define custom views. They allow LMS users having such a plugin
to get a filtered view on their music library. But (besides the demo
plugin implementation) they don't implement any virtual library view.
It'll be up to a plugin developer to make best use of this feature. Thus
it's not a replacement, but it'll allow to better (and simpler)
integrate such a plugin with LMS.

--

Michael
local.bin
2014-06-12 09:03:23 UTC
Permalink
mherger wrote:
> > Will this conflict with Erlands multi library plugin if we already
> have
> > that installed with 7.9?
>
> I don't think so. Unless you install a plugin making use of those new
> features there should be no change in behaviour at all. It's totally
> optional. Most of what I implemented was suggested by Erland (thanks!).
>
> I'm pretty sure he'd let me know quickly if I messed up his plugins.
>
> I'd rather expect him to take advantage of these changes. He's asked me
>
> to do them for good reason I must assume ;-).
>
> > Is it meant to be a replacement, or work with it.
>
> The changes I committed really are mostly "infrastructure": they allow a
>
> plugin to define custom views. They allow LMS users having such a plugin
>
> to get a filtered view on their music library. But (besides the demo
> plugin implementation) they don't implement any virtual library view.
> It'll be up to a plugin developer to make best use of this feature. Thus
>
> it's not a replacement, but it'll allow to better (and simpler)
> integrate such a plugin with LMS.
>
> --
>
> Michael

Ok great, thanks for the detailed response; understood, regards :)


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get.amped
2014-06-11 23:47:41 UTC
Permalink
mherger wrote:
> > Will this potentially be a way to circumvent the 100K track
> limitation
> > with the Smart Mix plugin? Seems like I should be able to create a
> > filtered library that would contain most of the "good" stuff based on
> > bitrate, genre, year range, etc.
>
> Yes, that's definitely a use case I was thinking about today myself. But
> first things first.

Oh, no rush for me, to be sure. Just curious. I'll just be lurking over
here until there's something to play with on my secondary system...



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Michael Herger
2014-06-12 03:25:27 UTC
Permalink
>>> Will this potentially be a way to circumvent the 100K track
>> limitation
>>> with the Smart Mix plugin? Seems like I should be able to create a
>>> filtered library that would contain most of the "good" stuff based on
>>> bitrate, genre, year range, etc.
>>
>> Yes, that's definitely a use case I was thinking about today myself. But
>> first things first.
>
> Oh, no rush for me, to be sure. Just curious. I'll just be lurking over
> here until there's something to play with on my secondary system...

I think the toughest part will be to provide the end user a flexible UI
to define the virtual libraries. If you were fluent in SQL, then this
would probably be an easy job to achieve. But to provide a good UI to
allow for filtering by all the attributes you mention will be the
challenge... for me and other plugin developers.

--

Michael
get.amped
2014-06-12 03:35:59 UTC
Permalink
mherger wrote:
> >>> Will this potentially be a way to circumvent the 100K track
> >> limitation
> >>> with the Smart Mix plugin? Seems like I should be able to create a
> >>> filtered library that would contain most of the "good" stuff based
> on
> >>> bitrate, genre, year range, etc.
> >>
> >> Yes, that's definitely a use case I was thinking about today myself.
> But
> >> first things first.
> >
> > Oh, no rush for me, to be sure. Just curious. I'll just be lurking
> over
> > here until there's something to play with on my secondary system...
>
> I think the toughest part will be to provide the end user a flexible UI
>
> to define the virtual libraries. If you were fluent in SQL, then this
> would probably be an easy job to achieve. But to provide a good UI to
> allow for filtering by all the attributes you mention will be the
> challenge... for me and other plugin developers.
>
> --
>
> Michael

Agreed. I have no issues writing SQL (assuming I understand the schema),
but that will definitely not be the case for most users.



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Michael Herger
2014-06-12 03:56:34 UTC
Permalink
> Agreed. I have no issues writing SQL (assuming I understand the schema),
> but that will definitely not be the case for most users.

Get some sqlite client and start playing around with library.db: the
library filtering is based on the tracks table. Genres will be tricky,
as the IDs can change during scans. But its feasible with an additional
relation to the genres table. Once you've got a good query, please feel
free to send it to me and I'll be playing with it.

Please note that the query is run at scan time. Thus even if the query
does take a few seconds to complete that shouldn't hurt usability in
daily use.

--

Michael
get.amped
2014-06-12 11:51:31 UTC
Permalink
mherger wrote:
> > Agreed. I have no issues writing SQL (assuming I understand the
> schema),
> > but that will definitely not be the case for most users.
>
> Get some sqlite client and start playing around with library.db: the
> library filtering is based on the tracks table. Genres will be tricky,
> as the IDs can change during scans. But its feasible with an additional
>
> relation to the genres table. Once you've got a good query, please feel
>
> free to send it to me and I'll be playing with it.
>
> Please note that the query is run at scan time. Thus even if the query
> does take a few seconds to complete that shouldn't hurt usability in
> daily use.
>
> --
>
> Michael

I've been using SQLite Expert to chase down some tagging consistency
issues. OCD enabler?

I'll put together some queries that would result in only FLAC,
non-Classical, non-Pop + whatever else it takes to pare things down to
less than 100K tracks. Even though the filtering is based on tracks,
joining with the genres table should not be an issue?



Win7Pro(x64)[3.3Ghz i5, 8GB RAM, 120GB SSD system, 15TB storage], LMS
7.9.0 -> Logitech Squeezebox Classic V.3 -> Cambridge Audio DacMagic ->
NAD C160 -> 2 x NAD C272 -> Quad 22L2
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Michael Herger
2014-06-12 11:59:05 UTC
Permalink
> I've been using SQLite Expert to chase down some tagging consistency
> issues. OCD enabler?

OCD enabler? http://de.pinterest.com/dkniep/ocd-enabler/ ?

> I'll put together some queries that would result in only FLAC,
> non-Classical, non-Pop + whatever else it takes to pare things down to
> less than 100K tracks. Even though the filtering is based on tracks,
> joining with the genres table should not be an issue?

The problem is that the track -> genre mapping is based on a genre_id
which changes during scan. You'll therefore have to have some sub-select
to get the ids based on the genre names you provide. It's probably not
an issue if you speak SQL fluently :-).

--

Michael
get.amped
2014-06-12 14:45:30 UTC
Permalink
mherger wrote:
> > I've been using SQLite Expert to chase down some tagging consistency
> > issues. OCD enabler?
>
> OCD enabler? http://de.pinterest.com/dkniep/ocd-enabler/ ?
>
> > I'll put together some queries that would result in only FLAC,
> > non-Classical, non-Pop + whatever else it takes to pare things down
> to
> > less than 100K tracks. Even though the filtering is based on tracks,
> > joining with the genres table should not be an issue?
>
> The problem is that the track -> genre mapping is based on a genre_id
> which changes during scan. You'll therefore have to have some sub-select
>
> to get the ids based on the genre names you provide. It's probably not
> an issue if you speak SQL fluently :-).
>
> --
>
> Michael

Well I did a couple of queries to get some idea just what would fit in
100K tracks. This one just gives me a count of tracks by genre for
lossless (FLAC) only:

SELECT
ge.namesearch, count (tr.id)
FROM
tracks tr,
genre_track gt,
genres ge
WHERE tr.content_type = 'flc'
AND tr.id = gt.track
AND gt.genre = ge.id
GROUP BY ge.namesearch
ORDER BY ge.namesearch

Unfortunately, ROLLUP is not supported by SQLite, so I can't get a grand
total in the same query.

But I put the results (134 rows) into Excel and played with different
combinations of genres until I got one that pares the 233,143 tracks
down to less than 100,000.

This query returns those rows:

SELECT
tr.*
FROM
tracks tr,
genre_track gt,
genres ge
WHERE tr.content_type = 'flc'
AND tr.id = gt.track
AND gt.genre = ge.id
AND ge.namesearch IN ('ALTERNATIVE ROCK','ART ROCK','BLUES
ROCK','DEAD','ELECTRONICA','FOLK JAZZ','FUNK','FUNK R B','FUNK
SOUL','FUSION','GRUNGE','HENDRIX','INDIE','JAZZ FOLK','JAZZ FUNK','JAZZ
FUSION','JAZZ ROCK','LATIN ROCK','NEW WAVE','PROGRESSIVE
METAL','PROGRESSIVE ROCK','PUNK ROCK','R B','R B FUNK','R B
SOUL','ROCK','SOUL','SOUL FUNK','SOUL R B','TRIP HOP')

It's not clear to me whether the query would have to be structured like
this to deal with the changing genre ids:

SELECT
tr.*
FROM
tracks tr,
genre_track gt,
genres ge
WHERE tr.content_type = 'flc'
AND tr.id = gt.track
AND gt.genre = ge.id
AND ge.id IN (SELECT x.id from genres x where x.namesearch IN
('ALTERNATIVE ROCK','ART ROCK','BLUES ROCK','DEAD','ELECTRONICA','FOLK
JAZZ','FUNK','FUNK R B','FUNK
SOUL','FUSION','GRUNGE','HENDRIX','INDIE','JAZZ FOLK','JAZZ FUNK','JAZZ
FUSION','JAZZ ROCK','LATIN ROCK','NEW WAVE','PROGRESSIVE
METAL','PROGRESSIVE ROCK','PUNK ROCK','R B','R B FUNK','R B
SOUL','ROCK','SOUL','SOUL FUNK','SOUL R B','TRIP HOP'))

Or if there is any substantive difference between the two.



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Michael Herger
2014-06-12 16:20:07 UTC
Permalink
> AND ge.namesearch IN ('ALTERNATIVE ROCK','ART ROCK','BLUES
> ROCK','DEAD','ELECTRONICA','FOLK JAZZ','FUNK','FUNK R B','FUNK
> SOUL','FUSION','GRUNGE','HENDRIX','INDIE','JAZZ FOLK','JAZZ FUNK','JAZZ
> FUSION','JAZZ ROCK','LATIN ROCK','NEW WAVE','PROGRESSIVE
> METAL','PROGRESSIVE ROCK','PUNK ROCK','R B','R B FUNK','R B
> SOUL','ROCK','SOUL','SOUL FUNK','SOUL R B','TRIP HOP')

> AND ge.id IN (SELECT x.id from genres x where x.namesearch IN
> ('ALTERNATIVE ROCK','ART ROCK','BLUES ROCK','DEAD','ELECTRONICA','FOLK
> JAZZ','FUNK','FUNK R B','FUNK
> SOUL','FUSION','GRUNGE','HENDRIX','INDIE','JAZZ FOLK','JAZZ FUNK','JAZZ
> FUSION','JAZZ ROCK','LATIN ROCK','NEW WAVE','PROGRESSIVE
> METAL','PROGRESSIVE ROCK','PUNK ROCK','R B','R B FUNK','R B
> SOUL','ROCK','SOUL','SOUL FUNK','SOUL R B','TRIP HOP'))

Did you time the duration these two need? In my limited testing with a
much smaller collection the second version seemed to be a tiny little
bit faster.

--

Michael
get.amped
2014-06-12 17:30:14 UTC
Permalink
mherger wrote:
> > AND ge.namesearch IN ('ALTERNATIVE ROCK','ART ROCK','BLUES
> > ROCK','DEAD','ELECTRONICA','FOLK JAZZ','FUNK','FUNK R B','FUNK
> > SOUL','FUSION','GRUNGE','HENDRIX','INDIE','JAZZ FOLK','JAZZ
> FUNK','JAZZ
> > FUSION','JAZZ ROCK','LATIN ROCK','NEW WAVE','PROGRESSIVE
> > METAL','PROGRESSIVE ROCK','PUNK ROCK','R B','R B FUNK','R B
> > SOUL','ROCK','SOUL','SOUL FUNK','SOUL R B','TRIP HOP')
>
> > AND ge.id IN (SELECT x.id from genres x where x.namesearch IN
> > ('ALTERNATIVE ROCK','ART ROCK','BLUES
> ROCK','DEAD','ELECTRONICA','FOLK
> > JAZZ','FUNK','FUNK R B','FUNK
> > SOUL','FUSION','GRUNGE','HENDRIX','INDIE','JAZZ FOLK','JAZZ
> FUNK','JAZZ
> > FUSION','JAZZ ROCK','LATIN ROCK','NEW WAVE','PROGRESSIVE
> > METAL','PROGRESSIVE ROCK','PUNK ROCK','R B','R B FUNK','R B
> > SOUL','ROCK','SOUL','SOUL FUNK','SOUL R B','TRIP HOP'))
>
> Did you time the duration these two need? In my limited testing with a
> much smaller collection the second version seemed to be a tiny little
> bit faster.
>
> --
>
> Michael

First one executes in 277 ms.

Second one in 225 ms.

This is running against a copy of a slightly older version of my
library.db

select count (id) from tracks

returns 311,530 rows.



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get.amped
2014-06-18 04:24:09 UTC
Permalink
The multi-library demo is quite nice. I may actually use the "FLAC files
only" quite a bit.



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Mnyb
2014-06-19 00:24:53 UTC
Permalink
get.amped wrote:
> The multi-library demo is quite nice. I may actually use the "FLAC files
> only" quite a bit.

Where did you find this ?

This demo plaugin seems a bit elusive i cant find any of its settings
anywhere nor the plugin itself ? in the plauging list



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Mnyb
2014-06-19 00:32:56 UTC
Permalink
Mnyb wrote:
> Where did you find this ?
>
> This demo plugin seems a bit elusive i cant find any of its settings
> anywhere nor the plugin itself ? in the plauging list

find that browse mode but not where to setup your own modes where did
this flac only being configured



--------------------------------------------------------------------
Main hifi: Touch + CIA PS +MeridianG68J MeridianHD621 MeridianG98DH 2 x
MeridianDSP5200 MeridianDSP5200HC 2 xMeridianDSP3100 +Rel Stadium 3
sub.
Bedroom/Office: Boom
Kitchen: Touch + powered Fostex PM0.4
Misc use: Radio (with battery)
iPad1 with iPengHD & SqueezePad
(in storage SB3, reciever ,controller )
server HP proliant micro server N36L with ClearOS Linux

http://people.xiph.org/~xiphmont/demo/neil-young.html
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get.amped
2014-06-19 02:08:51 UTC
Permalink
Mnyb wrote:
> find that browse mode but not where to setup your own modes where did
> this flac only being configured

First make sure "Switch library view is check in the per player
settings:

16059

Then go to "Switch library view" in My Music:

16060

Then select "FLAC files only"

16061

When you go back to "Home" you will see the change in the status line:

16062


+-------------------------------------------------------------------+
|Filename: librarystatus.jpg |
|Download: http://forums.slimdevices.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=16062|
+-------------------------------------------------------------------+


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NAD C160 -> 2 x NAD C272 -> Quad 22L2
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Mnyb
2014-06-19 05:05:22 UTC
Permalink
get.amped wrote:
> First make sure "Switch library view is check in the per player
> settings:
>
> 16059
>
> Then go to "Switch library view" in My Music:
>
> 16060
>
> Then select "FLAC files only"
>
> 16061
>
> When you go back to "Home" you will see the change in the status line:
>
> 16062

Aha that's all I've found those :) ok it works as designed , don't
remove it , it mostly aimed at other developers to use is it ?



--------------------------------------------------------------------
Main hifi: Touch + CIA PS +MeridianG68J MeridianHD621 MeridianG98DH 2 x
MeridianDSP5200 MeridianDSP5200HC 2 xMeridianDSP3100 +Rel Stadium 3
sub.
Bedroom/Office: Boom
Kitchen: Touch + powered Fostex PM0.4
Misc use: Radio (with battery)
iPad1 with iPengHD & SqueezePad
(in storage SB3, reciever ,controller )
server HP proliant micro server N36L with ClearOS Linux

http://people.xiph.org/~xiphmont/demo/neil-young.html
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Michael Herger
2014-06-19 06:33:36 UTC
Permalink
> Aha that's all I've found those :) ok it works as designed , don't
> remove it , it mostly aimed at other developers to use is it ?

Primarily for myself, to validate the changes. And as a demo for plugin
developers to show what can be done, and how it can be done.

I'm probably going to provide a different plugin which will make a
little more sense. Not strictly for the end-user, as it'll will require
you to do some SQL. But it would allow for experienced users to do
sub-libraries, and easily share these by posting some SQL to copy/paste.

--

Michael
mherger
2014-06-19 07:33:34 UTC
Permalink
I just added another library definition which I call "Lossless
Preferred": it attempts to solve the issue where users have two copies
of a track, once lossy (for mobile use) and once lossless. Previously
this would result in duplicate albums and tracks in your library. This
new library definition tries to filter out those dupes.

Please note that this will not merge albums if some tracks of the album
were lossy and others not. We can't easily compensate for the mess you
create ;-).

In order to get this virtual library you'll have to run a rescan (no
wipe required).

And for the geeks: here's the SQL I'm using. Please let me know if you
see any potential for improvement.


Code:
--------------------
SELECT tracks.id
FROM tracks, albums
WHERE albums.id = tracks.album
AND (
tracks.lossless
OR 1 NOT IN (
SELECT 1
FROM tracks other
JOIN albums otheralbums ON other.album
WHERE other.title = tracks.title
AND other.lossless
AND other.primary_artist = tracks.primary_artist
AND other.tracknum = tracks.tracknum
AND other.year = tracks.year
AND otheralbums.title = albums.title
)
)

--------------------


Tracks in this library are either lossless or there's no lossless track
with the same title, album title, primary artist, track number and year.



Michael

http://www.herger.net/slim-plugins - MusicArtistInfo, MusicInfoSCR,
Smart Mix
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erland
2014-06-19 11:27:50 UTC
Permalink
mherger wrote:
>
> I'm probably going to provide a different plugin which will make a
> little more sense. Not strictly for the end-user, as it'll will require
>
> you to do some SQL. But it would allow for experienced users to do
> sub-libraries, and easily share these by posting some SQL to
> copy/paste.
>
Just for information, I started to create a plugin based on my Multi
Library plugin today for this, it's going to be named "Virtual
Libraries".
Just mentioning it so we can avoid name collisions if you plan to do
something similar.

Hope to have it ready for beta testing at the end of the week unless I
get stuck on something.



Erland Isaksson ('My homepage' (http://erland.isaksson.info))
(Developer of 'many plugins/applets (both free and commercial)'
(http://wiki.slimdevices.com/index.php/User:Erland).
If you like to encourage future presence on this forum and/or third
party plugin/applet development, 'consider purchasing some plugins'
(http://license.isaksson.info))

*Interested in the future of music streaming ? 'ickStream - A world of
music at your fingertips'
(http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?98467-Pre-Announcement-ickStream&p=743516)*.
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Michael Herger
2014-06-19 13:56:54 UTC
Permalink
> Just for information, I started to create a plugin based on my Multi
> Library plugin today for this, it's going to be named "Virtual
> Libraries".
> Just mentioning it so we can avoid name collisions if you plan to do
> something similar.
>
> Hope to have it ready for beta testing at the end of the week unless I
> get stuck on something.

Sounds great! Though I probably won't have much time to test it, as I'll
be away all weekend, and leaving for 3 weeks in a week from now...

--

Michael
erland
2014-06-22 10:29:44 UTC
Permalink
I've published an initial beta version of a plugin (Custom Libraries) to
be able to setup more advanced libraries.

To install it you need to first install *License Manager* plugin, you
will get a free license automatically during the beta period the
dependency to License Manager plugin is just there for future use.
It will of course only work with latest 7.9 beta version of LMS.

To install the *Custom Libraries* plugin you need to setup an additional
repository in LMS Settings/Plugins (unless you already have my testing
repository configured):

Code:
--------------------

http://erlandplugins.googlecode.com/svn/repository/trunk/testing.xml

--------------------

Then select to instal "Custom Libraries" plugin.

It's a beta version and there are still stuff left to do and probably
lots of bugs, but it allows you to:
- Setup libraries with a lot of different parameters, you do this under
the "Extras/Custom Libraries" section on the main page of LMS.
Configuration will likely later be moved to settings menu in a later
version.
- It creates a menu under My Music for each library if you have select
the "Show in home menu" checkbox of the library configuration.

It's not yet supported by Custom Browse, SQL Playlist and Custom Skip
plugins, but this will likely come in a later version if there is a
demand.

I'd especially appreciate feedback regarding which parameters people
wants to use to setup libraries and what kind of customisation
possibilities you want in the browse menus. For example, is there a need
to make it possible to enable different sub menus for different
libraries ?



Erland Isaksson ('My homepage' (http://erland.isaksson.info))
(Developer of 'many plugins/applets (both free and commercial)'
(http://wiki.slimdevices.com/index.php/User:Erland).
If you like to encourage future presence on this forum and/or third
party plugin/applet development, 'consider purchasing some plugins'
(http://license.isaksson.info))

*Interested in the future of music streaming ? 'ickStream - A world of
music at your fingertips'
(http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?98467-Pre-Announcement-ickStream&p=743516)*.
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Phil Meyer
2014-06-22 22:22:41 UTC
Permalink
>I'd especially appreciate feedback regarding which parameters people
>wants to use to setup libraries and what kind of customisation
>possibilities you want in the browse menus. For example, is there a need
>to make it possible to enable different sub menus for different
>libraries ?
>
Early days - I'll have a play and report back.

But can I suggest that you put a note on the Custom Libraries server settings page, to tell users that libraries are configured via Home > Extras > Custom Libraries, rather than Settings > Advanced Settings > Custom Libraries?

Are there guidelines as to when things should be configured in Extras, rather than in Settings? It catches me out, as I often go to plugin settings (directly, or via plugins > {name} > Settings).

I tried configuring one custom library to identify music with low bitrate. Seemed very easy and useful - thanks!

General comment about custom libraries - it would be useful if a custom library could be included/excluded within the Random Mix.

When would a playlist appear within a custom library playlist sub-menu?
erland
2014-06-23 02:43:07 UTC
Permalink
Philip Meyer wrote:
> >I'd especially appreciate feedback regarding which parameters people
> >wants to use to setup libraries and what kind of customisation
> >possibilities you want in the browse menus. For example, is there a
> need
> >to make it possible to enable different sub menus for different
> >libraries ?
> >
> Early days - I'll have a play and report back.
>
> But can I suggest that you put a note on the Custom Libraries server
> settings page, to tell users that libraries are configured via Home >
> Extras > Custom Libraries, rather than Settings > Advanced Settings >
> Custom Libraries?
>
> Are there guidelines as to when things should be configured in Extras,
> rather than in Settings? It catches me out, as I often go to plugin
> settings (directly, or via plugins > {name} > Settings).
>
It will be moved to Settings, it's under Extras at this moment since I
copied a lot of code from MultiLibrary plugin

Philip Meyer wrote:
>
> General comment about custom libraries - it would be useful if a custom
> library could be included/excluded within the Random Mix.
>
It's on Michael's TODO list, I guess he will look at it when he is back
again in middle/end of July.

Philip Meyer wrote:
>
> When would a playlist appear within a custom library playlist sub-menu?
>
It's supposed to be there when at least one of the tracks in the
playlist is part of the library, but it looks like you have found a bug
because it's not working properly at the moment.



Erland Isaksson ('My homepage' (http://erland.isaksson.info))
(Developer of 'many plugins/applets (both free and commercial)'
(http://wiki.slimdevices.com/index.php/User:Erland).
If you like to encourage future presence on this forum and/or third
party plugin/applet development, 'consider purchasing some plugins'
(http://license.isaksson.info))

*Interested in the future of music streaming ? 'ickStream - A world of
music at your fingertips'
(http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?98467-Pre-Announcement-ickStream&p=743516)*.
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Phil Meyer
2014-06-22 22:52:36 UTC
Permalink
>I'd especially appreciate feedback regarding which parameters people
>wants to use to setup libraries and what kind of customisation
>possibilities you want in the browse menus. For example, is there a need
>to make it possible to enable different sub menus for different
>libraries ?
>
I had a play with TrackStat rating library. I would like to create a library of unrated music. I created a library for high rated (4* or greater), but there's no way to easily select only music that is unrated (can customise SQL).

I created a library, but forgot to change the default name. I edited the library and changed the name and saved as a new filename. I deleted the original library, but in "Switch library view" I can see the old (default) name "Surround Sound library without artist selection" as well as the new one. Home > Extras > Custom Libraries doesn't show the old item.
erland
2014-06-23 02:54:02 UTC
Permalink
Philip Meyer wrote:
> >I'd especially appreciate feedback regarding which parameters people
> >wants to use to setup libraries and what kind of customisation
> >possibilities you want in the browse menus. For example, is there a
> need
> >to make it possible to enable different sub menus for different
> >libraries ?
> >
> I had a play with TrackStat rating library. I would like to create a
> library of unrated music. I created a library for high rated (4* or
> greater), but there's no way to easily select only music that is unrated
> (can customise SQL).
>
Thanks, I'll try to add support for that.

Just note that libraries based on ratings aren't optimal since the
library content only is refreshed during rescan or when you adjust the
library parameters at the moment, so if you rate a track it won't
disappear from the unrated music library until you have performed a
rescan or re-saved the library. I could add a way to refresh the library
manually from the GUI to avoid the need to rescan, but I don't want to
do it automatically when you change a rating because there is a risk it
will cause performance problems when people change ratings in a large
music library.

Philip Meyer wrote:
>
> I created a library, but forgot to change the default name. I edited
> the library and changed the name and saved as a new filename. I deleted
> the original library, but in "Switch library view" I can see the old
> (default) name "Surround Sound library without artist selection" as well
> as the new one. Home > Extras > Custom Libraries doesn't show the old
> item.

Feels like a bug, thanks for reporting.
For now, it should disappear from "Switch library view" if you restart
LMS and it will disappear from the database tables next time your
perform a rescan (new/changed scan is enough).



Erland Isaksson ('My homepage' (http://erland.isaksson.info))
(Developer of 'many plugins/applets (both free and commercial)'
(http://wiki.slimdevices.com/index.php/User:Erland).
If you like to encourage future presence on this forum and/or third
party plugin/applet development, 'consider purchasing some plugins'
(http://license.isaksson.info))

*Interested in the future of music streaming ? 'ickStream - A world of
music at your fingertips'
(http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?98467-Pre-Announcement-ickStream&p=743516)*.
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erland
2014-08-14 05:44:06 UTC
Permalink
I'd like some ideas from people who are interested to divide their LMS
library into multiple virtual libraries.
Now when we have the support in the core of LMS we can start adding
functionality through plugins.

Would you like to separate your library and in that case how ?
Would the browse menus for each virtual library look the same or would
you like different browse structures for different libraries ?
How would the optimal default browse menu structure look like for the
virtual libraries you can imagine in your own setup ?



Erland Isaksson ('My homepage' (http://erland.isaksson.info))
(Developer of 'many plugins/applets (both free and commercial)'
(http://wiki.slimdevices.com/index.php/User:Erland).
If you like to encourage future presence on this forum and/or third
party plugin/applet development, 'consider purchasing some plugins'
(http://license.isaksson.info))

*Interested in the future of music streaming ? 'ickStream - A world of
music at your fingertips'
(http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?98467-Pre-Announcement-ickStream&p=743516)*.
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Michael Herger
2014-08-14 06:06:03 UTC
Permalink
> Would you like to separate your library and in that case how ?

I'd be the typical kids vs. my music case. I don't want to see my kids'
music. And they most likely don't care about mine.

> Would the browse menus for each virtual library look the same or would
> you like different browse structures for different libraries ?

Different. They're still young, and reading isn't really an option for
them. Artwork is crucial, stuff like genres, years etc. irrelevant.

> How would the optimal default browse menu structure look like for the
> virtual libraries you can imagine in your own setup ?

I'm so used to the standard setup, I don't even bother about Album
Artists or Compilations. It's fine with me.

--

Michael
pippin
2014-08-14 10:33:02 UTC
Permalink
Separate Music from audiobooks based on genre (actually a list of
genres) would be most important for me.
I can now create an audiobooks menu through the extended browse modes
but filtering the audiobooks from the main albums list is just as
important.
I would still want to show both menus but all the "standard" menu
structures should not include audiobooks and audiobooks should only be
available through their own audiobooks menu hierarchy.
This hierarchy should actually start with artists (albumartist is fine
with me since I don't think there's an "author" tag that is somehow
commonly used). With all albums sorted by artist being an option below
"audiobook artists".
It would be important to not only filter albums or tracks but also
artists, I would not want to see my audiobook artists in the list of
music artists as well.
For genres I would not care.



---
learn more about iPeng, the iPhone and iPad remote for the Squeezebox
and
Logitech UE Smart Radio as well as iPeng Party, the free Party-App,
at penguinlovesmusic.com
*New: iPeng 7, the Universal App for iOS 7*
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marlo
2014-09-07 17:07:30 UTC
Permalink
I would like to have a different library view for each folder added to
the library in general setup, named like the folder itself. So I could
easily switch between my love's, my kid's and my music. Can this be
done?




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Michael Herger
2014-09-08 04:35:14 UTC
Permalink
> I would like to have a different library view for each folder added to
> the library in general setup, named like the folder itself. So I could
> easily switch between my love's, my kid's and my music. Can this be
> done?

Not without a 3rd party library taking care of creating the views. But
I'm pretty sure Erland's plugin would do it.

--

Michael
marlo
2014-09-08 04:56:41 UTC
Permalink
Thank you Michael.
Is there any documentation available on how to create the views?




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Michael Herger
2014-09-08 07:25:45 UTC
Permalink
> Is there any documentation available on how to create the views?

Check Slim/Music/VirtualLibrary.pm
(https://github.com/Logitech/slimserver/blob/public/7.9/Slim/Music/VirtualLibraries.pm).
There's a minimum documentation. You can create a very basic plugin with
only initPlugin. Then do a bunch of registerLibrary() calls with some
simple SQL to filter out what you want.

--

Michael
Chunkywizard
2014-10-02 12:13:09 UTC
Permalink
Just to say, I tried this and it works really well. Thanks for the
feature.

CW



*Squeezebox:* Boom x2 (Kitchen and Office), Radio x2 (Lounge and
Bedroom)
*Server:* 7.8 for Wandboard Dual
*Plugins:* Dynamic Playlists | SQL Playlist | Music Information Screen |
TrackStat
*Remote:* iPhone5/iPad Air running 'iPeng'
(http://penguinlovesmusic.de/2008/11/25/ipeng-application-now-on-app-store/)
*Music: *'Last.fm' (http://www.last.fm/user/chunkywizard)
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bigcookie
2014-10-05 11:43:58 UTC
Permalink
erland wrote:
> I'd like some ideas from people who are interested to divide their LMS
> library into multiple virtual libraries.
> Now when we have the support in the core of LMS we can start adding
> functionality through plugins.
>
> Would you like to separate your library and in that case how ?
> Would the browse menus for each virtual library look the same or would
> you like different browse structures for different libraries ?
> How would the optimal default browse menu structure look like for the
> virtual libraries you can imagine in your own setup ?

Hi Erland,

what about the use case (might be constructed): user has music on
several USB sticks. All of them get scanned, but you only want to show
the music which is available on the attached USB device? In this case,
the filter needs to be based on the USB device ID or something similar.
Idea might not be a standard use case though.

regards,

André


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PasTim
2014-10-05 12:10:31 UTC
Permalink
erland wrote:
> I'd like some ideas from people who are interested to divide their LMS
> library into multiple virtual libraries.
> Now when we have the support in the core of LMS we can start adding
> functionality through plugins.
>
> Would you like to separate your library and in that case how ?
> Would the browse menus for each virtual library look the same or would
> you like different browse structures for different libraries ?
> How would the optimal default browse menu structure look like for the
> virtual libraries you can imagine in your own setup ?
I effectively do this already based on genre, separating classical from
everything else (my classical library has both 'classical' genre' and a
more specific genre for the track), since I use additional tags on
classical, and use custom browse to create menus for these that do not
work for other genres such as pop, rock, etc.

I could well imagine it would be useful to create more specific browse
structures for different types of recording (including audiobooks,
comedy etc), different libraries and menus for different users, and for
tracks from other sources such as internet radio, spotify and so on.
However, whether I personally really 'need' more than I already have is
a moot point.



LMS 7.9 on VortexBox Midi running Xubuntu 14.04, FLACs 16->24 bit,
44.1->192kbps. Wired Touch + EDO, coax to Musical Fidelity M1 CLiC.
Alternatively squeezelite to a bit of home-cooked code and thence to M1
CLiC using a UPNP stream. Wireless Xubuntu 14.04 laptop controls LMS via
Chromium. Meridian Explorer USB DAC to listen via Squeezelite on
Vortexbox & other PCs as required. Spare Touch in loft.
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steely74
2014-10-06 19:08:17 UTC
Permalink
A while back I installed the demo of the multi library plugin. Life got
in the way and I never tried it out. Well I bought it the other night
and could never get it to function how I wanted. I then found 7.9 and
the beta plugin!

Like others my reasoning for separate library's is to not hear kids
music when I use shuffle. Once I get this working I'll set up the same
for xmas music, non kid friendly stuff etc. I know this can be done
with dynamic playlist filtering genres but I like the idea of the
library menu (so my wife can use it too).

I went to custom library settings and selected "Standard library without
artist selection". I named it "no kids test”, then beside Excluded
Directory 1 I entered J:\ServerFolders\Lucy's Music. Hit next and then
save. Doing it this way did not seem to work. I did a full re-scan as
well. I then went back and edited it to exclud any kids genres (I
tagged the genre as "kids" for all her music). This way it worked
perfectly!

So is this the fact that exclude directory doesn't work a bug or am I
doing something wrong?

Also how do I random mix/shuffle from the new library's? I do not see
that option. I see where I can exclude genres from the "random mix"
settings. I would like to be able to random mix any library I choose.
So I could shuffle her music or mine. Or at xmas shuffle my "xmas
library".

Thanks!


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Michael Herger
2014-10-06 19:33:32 UTC
Permalink
> Also how do I random mix/shuffle from the new library's? I do not see

That's a feature I'd like to implement at some point, but it doesn't exist yet. There's no RandomPlay integration of libraries other than respecting the library you've chosen to show in you menu.

Michael
steely74
2014-10-06 19:39:24 UTC
Permalink
> There's no RandomPlay integration of libraries other than respecting the
> library you've chosen to show in you menu.

Thanks. I have the "no kids" displayed along with the main menu. Just
no way to random play it.


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erland
2014-10-07 03:53:48 UTC
Permalink
steely74 wrote:
> I went to custom library settings and selected "Standard library without
> artist selection". I named it "no kids test”, then beside Excluded
> Directory 1 I entered J:\ServerFolders\Lucy's Music. Hit next and then
> save. Doing it this way did not seem to work. I did a full re-scan as
> well. I then went back and edited it to exclud any kids genres (I
> tagged the genre as "kids" for all her music). This way it worked
> perfectly!
>
> So is this the fact that exclude directory doesn't work a bug or am I
> doing something wrong?
>
I wonder if it might be the '-character that's causing the problem.

Could you goto a song under Lucy's Music in the LMS web interface and
look at the "Location" attribute and post what it says so we can make
sure its first part looks exactly the same ?



Erland Isaksson ('My homepage' (http://erland.isaksson.info))
(Developer of 'many plugins/applets (both free and commercial)'
(http://wiki.slimdevices.com/index.php/User:Erland).
If you like to encourage future presence on this forum and/or third
party plugin/applet development, 'consider purchasing some plugins'
(http://license.isaksson.info))

*Interested in the future of music streaming ? 'ickStream - A world of
music at your fingertips'
(http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?98467-Pre-Announcement-ickStream&p=743516)*.
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steely74
2014-10-08 19:03:45 UTC
Permalink
Here you go! After my post the other day I made a library that was kids
stuff only. I tried using the "include directory" this time using the
Lucy's music. It did not work either. I excluded other genres and it
worked.


[image:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v488/datdork/sb1_zpsa72dc52d.jpg]

I can try and name the folder Lucys Music with no '


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steely74
2014-10-10 04:13:43 UTC
Permalink
I renamed the folder "Lucys Music" instead of "luc*y's* Music". The
include and exclude directly now works!


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JJZolx
2014-11-12 10:22:46 UTC
Permalink
What is the current status of the demo plugin? Is it included with
current builds and enabled by default? If so, is it time to either
exclude it or else leave it disabled in new installs?


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Michael Herger
2014-11-12 10:39:14 UTC
Permalink
> What is the current status of the demo plugin?

Heh... I thought I had removed it a few weeks ago.

> Is it included with current builds and enabled by default?

Included: yes. Enabled by default: no.

> If so, is it time to either
> exclude it or else leave it disabled in new installs?

I think it's time to pull it. If somebody wants to define the one useful
"flac only" library, then this can easily be achieved using the Advanced
Search.

Objections?

--

Michael
steely74
2014-11-16 19:16:11 UTC
Permalink
I've found it very useful! very easy to make a kids only menu,a
christmas menu, a "no kids music" library etc.


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pippin
2014-11-22 10:15:16 UTC
Permalink
Has there been any other activity around this or is it only usable
through the advanced search now?



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Mnyb
2014-11-22 10:53:34 UTC
Permalink
How do you use it with advanced search ? or make something similar I
quite liked the simplicity of these settings



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Michael Herger
2014-11-25 08:57:56 UTC
Permalink
> Has there been any other activity around this or is it only usable
> through the advanced search now?

The change was supposed to simplify 3rd party implementations. I never
planned to do a UI to define libraries. Because building a good UI for
this is no simple feat.

The fact that I was able to get something done using Advanced Search I
didn't even recognize until late. But as you say, it's far from perfect.

> Using advanced search. You can't build a library that only excludes
> stuff and you can't do an advanced search for (or excluding) several
> genres

You could save the search, shut down LMS, then edit the configuration...

--

Michael
pippin
2014-11-22 11:36:02 UTC
Permalink
Define a search and then save that as a library



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pippin
2014-11-22 11:38:24 UTC
Permalink
My biggest issue is that the libraries I'd really need would not work
this way (audiobooks excluded from library and separate menu for only
the audiobooks)



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Michael Herger
2014-11-22 12:08:55 UTC
Permalink
What is "this way"?


> Am 22.11.2014 um 12:38 schrieb pippin <***@no-mx.forums.slimdevices.com>:
>
>
> My biggest issue is that the libraries I'd really need would not work
> this way (audiobooks excluded from library and separate menu for only
> the audiobooks)
>
>
>
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pippin
2014-11-22 22:44:17 UTC
Permalink
Using advanced search. You can't build a library that only excludes
stuff and you can't do an advanced search for (or excluding) several
genres



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Michael Herger
2014-11-25 16:41:15 UTC
Permalink
> Using advanced search. You can't build a library that only excludes
> stuff and you can't do an advanced search for (or excluding) several
> genres

You can: there's an option "textsearch" or "not in text search" where
you can manually enter genre names. Doesn't this do what you want it to
do? I'm pretty sure I added this for your exact use case.

--

Michael
pippin
2014-11-25 22:06:11 UTC
Permalink
How do I tag genres? Or is it just the text so that titles including the
word aren't shown either?



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Michael Herger
2014-11-26 05:03:26 UTC
Permalink
> How do I tag genres?

You're not seriously asking me how to tag your files? You could even do
this in iTunes, can't you?

> Or is it just the text so that titles including the
> word aren't shown either?

If the audiobooks are tagged with the "Audiobook" genre, then select
"not in text search" for genre and enter "audiobook".

--

Michael
pippin
2014-11-26 12:12:46 UTC
Permalink
mherger wrote:
> > How do I tag genres?
>
> You're not seriously asking me how to tag your files?
>
No, of course not. I meant tagging them in the search.

What I didn't realize was that the "text search" and "not in text
search" items specifically allow you to define terms for Genres because
the text field didn't show up until I selected these choices. Until then
I had thought that it's just a full-text search so that e.g. excluding
"book" would also exclude e.g. "Booka Shade".
Maybe it would help others who are as ignorant as me to always show the
text field and disable it instead of hiding it? OTOH it would clutter up
the page even more, don't know, maybe I just should have looked at the
option more closely.....

Can I use several genres as ";"-separated list?



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JJZolx
2014-11-26 12:36:21 UTC
Permalink
pippin wrote:
> What I didn't realize was that the "text search" and "not in text
> search" items specifically allow you to define terms for Genres because
> the text field didn't show up until I selected these choices. Until then
> I had thought that it's just a full-text search so that e.g. excluding
> "book" would also exclude e.g. "Booka Shade".
> Maybe it would help others who are as ignorant as me to always show the
> text field and disable it instead of hiding it? OTOH it would clutter up
> the page even more, don't know, maybe I just should have looked at the
> option more closely.....

Yeah, that's what I was thinking, also. Display the text input box, but
disable it (and remove any text entered) unless one of the two genre
text search options are selected in the drop-down.


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Michael Herger
2014-11-26 13:52:52 UTC
Permalink
> Can I use several genres as ";"-separated list?

Use the comma as a delimiter.

--

Michael
pippin
2014-11-26 14:34:13 UTC
Permalink
OK, still a few issues:


- The entry field is too short, I don't even get half of my "speech"
Genres in there
- The entry field disappears as soon as you come back from another
screen (e.g. return from search results). Which is especially a
problem since...
- To save a library view you first have to search, you can't just
specify the parameters and save
- There is no way to still use the whole library in "additional
browse modes" unlike what was originally envisioned with the
libraries. IIRC the original idea was that you can apply a filter to
the whole library but still create other menus that do not use that
filter although the "normal" menus use it. So there is currently no
way to have audiobooks excluded from the library and still show them
in a separate menu. Which would kind of have been the idea behind it
for me :) Actually the same for Christmas music and such. Ideally, I
would want to specify a list of genres that I just don't want to see
in my main library but which are only available through dedicated,
special menus: Books, Christmas music, Childrens' stuff,... Whatever
your specific use case it.



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Michael Herger
2014-11-27 07:47:03 UTC
Permalink
> - The entry field is too short, I don't even get half of my "speech"
> Genres in there

It's 100 characters - how many of those genres do you have?!? Fix your
tags :-P

> - The entry field disappears as soon as you come back from another
> screen (e.g. return from search results). Which is especially a
> problem since...
> - To save a library view you first have to search, you can't just
> specify the parameters and save

I'll see what I can reasonably do here.

> - There is no way to still use the whole library in "additional
> browse modes" unlike what was originally envisioned with the
> libraries. IIRC the original idea was that you can apply a filter to
> the whole library but still create other menus that do not use that
> filter although the "normal" menus use it.

The original request was Erland asking for some infrastructure to create
a better multi library plugin. That's what I did: I implemented the
infrastructure.

I never promised the full functionality he is providing with his
plugins. I didn't even plan to provide a UI beyond the few test cases I
implemented in the demo plugin. I didn't even plan to use the advanced
search to create libraries. But when the idea came up... I should have
resisted.

Now all a dev needs to create some great multi library plugin should be
there. I still hope someone will pick it up and come up with a solution
which opens up the full potential for the users. I for myself will
probably write my own q'n'd plugin where I can copy/paste SQL to define
libraries. But I won't try to build a nice UI.

> So there is currently no
> way to have audiobooks excluded from the library and still show them
> in a separate menu.

As I've already started implementing this stuff I'll probably have to
consider this a bug...

> special menus: Books, Christmas music, Childrens' stuff,... Whatever
> your specific use case it.

Kids music... you hit my weak point. Crap.

--
--

Michael
pippin
2014-11-27 12:37:48 UTC
Permalink
mherger wrote:
> > - The entry field is too short, I don't even get half of my "speech"
> > Genres in there
>
> It's 100 characters - how many of those genres do you have?!? Fix your
> tags :-P
>
Two languages, podcasts, speech, audiobooks and plays and you are beyond
100 characters. I think I have more like 300 characters worth of Genres
or so.

>
> I never promised the full functionality he is providing with his
> plugins. I didn't even plan to provide a UI beyond the few test cases I
>
> implemented in the demo plugin. I didn't even plan to use the advanced
> search to create libraries. But when the idea came up... I should have
> resisted.
>
I know. But you asked why the Advanced Search doesn't solve my library
problem and this is why :)

Back in this thread you explain that the metric envisioned for this
logic is to be able to create menus that use different library filters,
that was the reason for that new parameter I had to change iPeng for,
wasn't it?

>
> As I've already started implementing this stuff I'll probably have to
> consider this a bug...
>
> > special menus: Books, Christmas music, Childrens' stuff,...
> Whatever
> > your specific use case it.
>
> Kids music... you hit my weak point. Crap.
>

Everybody has a weak spot :)



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pippin
2014-11-27 12:40:16 UTC
Permalink
One way to address this could be through a means of (optionally)
specifying the library a menu refers to when you define an "additional
browse mode". That way you could create a new menu that uses a
predefined library and stays the same whichever library you chose for
the main menu.



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Michael Herger
2014-11-28 14:10:55 UTC
Permalink
> One way to address this could be through a means of (optionally)
> specifying the library a menu refers to when you define an "additional
> browse mode".

Ok, you can now select whether you want to follow the "global" library
selection (old behaviour), or whether your menu should be applied to the
unfiltered library.

> That way you could create a new menu that uses a
> predefined library and stays the same whichever library you chose for
> the main menu.

The current implementation doesn't allow you to select a specific
library view. But it should be possible. Would need some more work, in
particular in the UI.

--

Michael
Michael Herger
2014-11-28 14:28:05 UTC
Permalink
> The current implementation doesn't allow you to select a specific
> library view. But it should be possible. Would need some more work, in
> particular in the UI.

Scratch that. Was easy enough (though the UI isn't brilliant...). Name
your menu, pick a library view and artist or album. Now you got yet
another way to define custom menu items...

--

Michael
JJZolx
2014-11-28 14:35:59 UTC
Permalink
mherger wrote:
>
> > One way to address this could be through a means of (optionally)
> > specifying the library a menu refers to when you define an
> "additional
> > browse mode".
>
> Ok, you can now select whether you want to follow the "global" library
> selection (old behaviour), or whether your menu should be applied to the
>
> unfiltered library.

Where is that?

>
> > That way you could create a new menu that uses a
> > predefined library and stays the same whichever library you chose for
> > the main menu.
>
> The current implementation doesn't allow you to select a specific
> library view. But it should be possible. Would need some more work, in
> particular in the UI.

Wow. This is beginning to get confusing. :)

I think one issue may be that of terminology. Too many different uses of
the word "library".


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Michael Herger
2014-11-28 15:15:49 UTC
Permalink
> Wow. This is beginning to get confusing. :)

Agreed.

> I think one issue may be that of terminology. Too many different uses of
> the word "library".

The good news about this issue is that you don't need any developer's skills to fix it. Feel free to come up with good terminology and I'll do my best to follow and implement it.
pippin
2014-11-28 18:00:21 UTC
Permalink
Cool, that was quick, will give that a try. This sounds really like it
could be worthwhile switching to 7.9 for my main system soon :)



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pippin
2014-11-29 07:49:39 UTC
Permalink
mherger wrote:
>
> Scratch that. Was easy enough (though the UI isn't brilliant...). Name
> your menu, pick a library view and artist or album. Now you got yet
> another way to define custom menu items...
>

Could it be that you only support the "library_id" = "-1" Parameter
needed for this to work in the "browselibrary" command but not in the
"normal" CLI commands like tracks, artists, albums,....

It doesn't work in iPeng, even though iPeng does send the correct
library id.



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Michael Herger
2014-12-01 08:32:33 UTC
Permalink
> Could it be that you only support the "library_id" = "-1" Parameter
> needed for this to work in the "browselibrary" command but not in the
> "normal" CLI commands like tracks, artists, albums,....

Yes, it's a menu level parameter. I did not want to move even more logic to the queries. They should simply return what they're told to do, and try to be as little smart as possible imho.

> It doesn't work in iPeng, even though iPeng does send the correct
> library id.

There's a price for going your own way...
pippin
2014-12-01 09:55:35 UTC
Permalink
mherger wrote:
> > Could it be that you only support the "library_id" = "-1" Parameter
> > needed for this to work in the "browselibrary" command but not in the
> > "normal" CLI commands like tracks, artists, albums,....
>
> Yes, it's a menu level parameter. I did not want to move even more logic
> to the queries. They should simply return what they're told to do, and
> try to be as little smart as possible imho.
>
Umm... but there is no way to make them do this. They don't accept the
parameter, that's the problem.
I have no problem to tell them what to do, but the functionality is
missing. They accept a "library_id" parameter now, just not this one.

So the "library_id" parameter is completely useless, or what is this?

>
> There's a price for going your own way...

You mean there should be a price for using officially documented
functionality instead of undocumented, reverse-engineered stuff? Nah.



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Michael Herger
2014-12-01 12:05:39 UTC
Permalink
>> Yes, it's a menu level parameter. I did not want to move even more logic
>> to the queries. They should simply return what they're told to do, and
>> try to be as little smart as possible imho.
>>
> Umm... but there is no way to make them do this. They don't accept the
> parameter, that's the problem.

The problem we're trying to resolve is that for some menu items we want
to override the globally set library_id. Menu code would use that latter
if none was defined in a menu item. Therefore we have to define one,
which I chose to be -1. The reason for this value is probably a bit
perly: above condition would read something like:

$library_id = $params->{library_id} || $prefs->get('library_id')

Which reads: use the library_id stored in the parameters, or stored in
the preferences. In perl 0 is the same as false. Which means that
sending an ID of 0 would cause the code to use the globally set value
(the one in the prefs).

> And thinking about it again (hate these many replies, you really should
> find a way to read edited posts...) why do you use "-1" as a parameter
> at all? Shouldn't "0" do just as well?

For the aforementioned reason 0 wouldn't work, as it would be ignored
and the default value be used instead. What you'd have to do in your
code is to remove the parameter (or set it to 0) if -1 is being passed.

>> There's a price for going your own way...
>
> You mean there should be a price for using officially documented
> functionality instead of undocumented, reverse-engineered stuff? Nah.

Nope. You decided that the menus as defined for SP were not good enough
for your use. Therefore you're using the well documented queries to
implement the menus yourself. That's perfectly fine. You just have to
bite the bullet and go all the way there. You can't expect us/me to
implement your cherry-picked functionality here or there, depending on
what you want/don't want to implement on your own. Didn't you ask me to
add library_id to the status query in order to allow you to implement
your own menus? Now please don't stop half way.

We/I've taken much blame for putting too much logic eg. into the artists
query. Now I'm trying to stay away from the same problem and it's not
right either. Oh well...

--

Michael
pippin
2014-12-01 18:18:52 UTC
Permalink
mherger wrote:
>
> The problem we're trying to resolve is that for some menu items we want
>
> to override the globally set library_id.
>

No, from a client perspective it's a different problem: from a client
perspective there is no "globally defined library_id" when using the
CLI. From a client perspective you are simply using an invalid
library_id in the menus.

>
> Nope. You decided that the menus as defined for SP were not good enough
>
> for your use.
>
Yes. And that is probably something that doesn't only affect iPeng but
_anybody_ using the documented CLI.

>
> You can't expect us/me to
> implement your cherry-picked functionality here or there, depending on
> what you want/don't want to implement on your own.
>
I don't want you to implement cherry picked functionality, I just want
you to only use valid library_ids.

Having different "library_id" value ranges across different functions
isn't exactly a good design.

>
> Didn't you ask me to
> add library_id to the status query in order to allow you to implement
> your own menus? Now please don't stop half way.
>


>
> We/I've taken much blame for putting too much logic eg. into the artists
>
> query. Now I'm trying to stay away from the same problem and it's not
> right either. Oh well...
>

By whom? Tell me where? I can't remember anyone complaining about that
at any time.
The only thing _I_ ever complained about is that you don't expose the
model layer and obfuscate content type by using intransparent and
undocumented functions to create the menus.
It would actually make a lot of things in LMS much more transparent,
less confusing, easier to debug and less error prone if you would simply
use the same API in your menus that you expose in the documentation,
which is the CLI. "Eat you own dog food" has always been a good primary
guideline for API design. It helps to solve so many issues.
I'm still getting requests every day to make simple changes to menus
where it's not possible due to this issue.

If I now use some arbitrary logic to replace "-1" library values by
something else or removing it, in a year we will all have forgotten and
when you do the next change then it will break something else and we
need to change everything all over again.



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pippin
2014-12-01 18:21:22 UTC
Permalink
>
> Didn't you ask me to
> add library_id to the status query in order to allow you to implement
> your own menus? Now please don't stop half way.
>
Sure, but I wanted to be able to _understand_ what your menus do. That's
all I ever ask of you on an API level: make transparent what LMS is
doing with menus. It's what we perpetually discuss and this is just one
more example.



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Michael Herger
2014-11-27 12:48:08 UTC
Permalink
> Back in this thread you explain that the metric envisioned for this
> logic is to be able to create menus that use different library filters,
> that was the reason for that new parameter I had to change iPeng for,
> wasn't it?

Yes. And that's why I said:

>> As I've already started implementing this stuff I'll probably have to
>> consider this a bug...

Genre input field should now accept 1000 characters.

--

Michael
pippin
2014-11-27 12:56:16 UTC
Permalink
That sounds like "enough" :D



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erland
2014-12-01 19:08:49 UTC
Permalink
mherger wrote:
>
> The original request was Erland asking for some infrastructure to create
>
> a better multi library plugin. That's what I did: I implemented the
> infrastructure.
>
Thanks for what you did, I really appreciate it, just wish I had a bit
more time to actually take advantage of all the possibilities.
:-)

mherger wrote:
>
> Now all a dev needs to create some great multi library plugin should be
>
> there. I still hope someone will pick it up and come up with a solution
>
> which opens up the full potential for the users. I for myself will
> probably write my own q'n'd plugin where I can copy/paste SQL to define
>
> libraries. But I won't try to build a nice UI.
>
I guess people who are happy with a technical user interface have found
the Custom Libraries plugin I've already done. It's basically a version
of my existing Multi Library plugin adapted to work with the new
features in 7.9.
http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?101701-Multi-Library-support-in-LMS-7-9&p=784179#post784179



Erland Isaksson ('My homepage' (http://erland.isaksson.info))
(Developer of 'many plugins/applets (both free and commercial)'
(http://wiki.slimdevices.com/index.php/User:Erland).
If you like to encourage future presence on this forum and/or third
party plugin/applet development, 'consider purchasing some plugins'
(http://license.isaksson.info))

*Interested in the future of music streaming ? 'ickStream - A world of
music at your fingertips'
(http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?98467-Pre-Announcement-ickStream&p=743516)*.
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JJZolx
2014-11-22 22:47:20 UTC
Permalink
pippin wrote:
> Using advanced search. You can't build a library that only excludes
> stuff and you can't do an advanced search for (or excluding) several
> genres

Yeah, the genres aspect of Advanced Search is its biggest weakness.
Being able do searches for things like 'Blues' and 'Christmas', or
everything except 'Childrens' would be really nice.


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Michael Herger
2014-11-25 08:57:49 UTC
Permalink
> Yeah, the genres aspect of Advanced Search is its biggest weakness.
> Being able do searches for things like 'Blues' and 'Christmas', or
> everything except 'Childrens' would be really nice.

Christmas is the problem here! We've had it in RandomPlay before... and
multiple genres per track. Yeah, advanced search is far from perfect.
Maybe I'll get back to it at some point.

--

Michael
Michael Herger
2014-06-19 03:04:25 UTC
Permalink
>> This demo plugin seems a bit elusive i cant find any of its settings
>> anywhere nor the plugin itself ? in the plauging list
>
> find that browse mode but not where to setup your own modes where did
> this flac only being configured

It's a DEMO. There's nothing to configure. I guess I'll have to remove it...

--

Michael
erland
2014-06-12 05:52:17 UTC
Permalink
mherger wrote:
>
> I think the toughest part will be to provide the end user a flexible UI
>
> to define the virtual libraries. If you were fluent in SQL, then this
> would probably be an easy job to achieve. But to provide a good UI to
> allow for filtering by all the attributes you mention will be the
> challenge... for me and other plugin developers.
>
My plan is to make a plugin that allows similar configuration abilities
as my current Multi Library plugin, this way people won't have to learn
SQL.
Just have to find the time, but I think it should be reasonably simple
as I have most of the code already in Multi Library plugin, it just have
to be cleaned-up a bit and adapted to work with the new API.

I think I'm going to focus on library definition to start with and let
people use your additional browse modes plugin to add browse menus
(assuming it's going to contain support for creating menus restricted to
a virtual library)

Some of my other plugins are likely also going to be updated, but I
consider something based on my current Multi Library plugin to be the
highest priority as this makes it possible for people to create flexible
libraries that can be used with other plugins.



Erland Isaksson ('My homepage' (http://erland.isaksson.info))
(Developer of 'many plugins/applets (both free and commercial)'
(http://wiki.slimdevices.com/index.php/User:Erland).
If you like to encourage future presence on this forum and/or third
party plugin/applet development, 'consider purchasing some plugins'
(http://license.isaksson.info))

*Interested in the future of music streaming ? 'ickStream - A world of
music at your fingertips'
(http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?98467-Pre-Announcement-ickStream&p=743516)*.
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Michael Herger
2014-06-11 21:10:39 UTC
Permalink
> Does this result in any
> - CLI/JSON API changes

Yes: the artists/genres/albums/titles queries now accept a library_id parameter to limit results to one library view. But no major changes. I should probably add CLI commands to deal with library definitions etc. But that's not there yet.

I'll have to double-check whether I've updated the documentation appropriately. I thought I did. But then it's been a long day...

> - server API changes (e.g. in Slim::Schema)

There's a new relation from Tracks to LibraryTracks, which eg. is being used in the RandomPlay plugin. And there was code added in many places to handle with a library_id player pref.
Michael Herger
2014-06-12 03:52:23 UTC
Permalink
> One thing I don't understand and which is currently between me and a
> good iPeng support for this: how is the usage model for this supposed to
> look like?

The most important part causing confusion seems to be what that change
provides: as Erland suggested in the other thread there's no real UI to
this yet (except for the LibraryDemo implementation which I mostly did
to verify my changes). It's an infrastructure to allow filtered views on
a library.

The title might be slightly misleading. I could have called it "Virtual
Library" or "Filtered Library View" instead.

BUT it's up to a plugin developer to a.) create the filter and b.)
define how it's being used.

If the plugin dev does care about b.) then he can provide his own menu
item, without changing the behaviour of the existing menus. Imagine eg.
an Audiobook plugin which registered a custom menu to specifically
browse your audiobooks only by Author, Title etc. This mode already
should work with iPeng etc. the very same way as existing extensions
work (eg. SmartMix).

In the simplest case the dev doesn't care about b.) though. In this case
LMS would provide a "Select Library View" menu item in My Music. When
the user selects one of those views, then a player pref is set with a
library_id. S::M::BrowseLibrary will use that library_id to provide the
existing My Music browse modes, but limited to that particular virtual
library.

This case will cause problems with iPeng et al. if they're not using
S::M::BrowseLibrary. They'll have to take care of requesting data with
the library_id on their own. Adding the library_id to the player status
might be one solution to let you know about it.

> If you think purely player-centric as in SqueezePlay I can kind of get
> it but the Squeezebox system, after all, is also a multiroom system so
> you need some way to handle that.

This change is mostly about accessing your library. If you have eg.
synchronized players and you select a filtered view on player one, then
player two would still provide the full browsing, but would play
whatever you chose on player one. Or you could play anything on player
two by controlling it through player one. It's really only (mostly) the
view on your collection while browsing it which changes.

> How is this supposed to look like? Is this like different servers all
> with their respective players?

No. It's a filtered view on your one server.

> How do I know which player belongs to which virtual server?

All players are still connected to the same player. But potentially
using a different view on your players.

> Is there a way to learn about these assignments?

Limited at this point: you can always use the player's pref query to get
the library_id value. But other than that I'm planning to provide CLI
support to get the list of libraries available, and as you suggested,
add the library_id to the player status.

> How do I switch players between them?

You don't have to switch players. You have to tell LMS by what
library_id you want your artists/albums etc. filtered. eg.

artists 0 200 library_id:abcde

> What about MySB?

Has nothing to do with this.

> At least in iPeng, all main menus are NOT player-specific (the caching
> effort for people with lots of players and/or large libraries would
> probably be prohibitive) so to get this usable we need some kind of user
> model of how this whole thing is supposed to work.

I don't know how plugin developers/users are going to use this feature.
Eg. how many different libraries there will be for a user. I would not
cache by player, but by library. Most users probably will never use more
than one library at any time. They'll probably use custom menu items
(Audiobooks), but not fully filtered views on their library. And if they
did, they probably use two or three (eg. Kids music, lossless library,
no DSD on Classic etc.).

As a 3rd party developer I consider using this for SmartMix: users can
define what part of their music should be mixed. But they'd probably
never use this library view to browse their music.

--

Michael
JJZolx
2014-06-12 05:48:14 UTC
Permalink
mherger wrote:
> The LibraryDemo plugin is disabled by default. If you want to test these
> new features you'll have to to enable it and re-run a scan.

Are you sure it's disabled by default? It's active on my server and I
never enabled it.

Why the need for a rescan?

It's not clear to me how the filtering is supposed to work. Using the
web UI, I browse into 'Albums with outros and other longish tracks',
select an album and I see only the long tracks. But if I press the album
play or queue buttons at the top, it queues all tracks from the album.
This seems to be dependent on the library view chosen. In this case it's
still set at 'All Library'. I see that if set to 'Longish tracks only'
then it works more like I would expect.

I don't quite see the purpose of the library view. Explain how this
setting might be used.


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Michael Herger
2014-06-12 06:36:21 UTC
Permalink
>> The LibraryDemo plugin is disabled by default. If you want to test these
>> new features you'll have to to enable it and re-run a scan.
>
> Are you sure it's disabled by default? It's active on my server and I
> never enabled it.
>
> Why the need for a rescan?

Yep, I changed my mind last minute. In order to get this tested I
enabled it by default.

> It's not clear to me how the filtering is supposed to work. Using the
> web UI, I browse into 'Albums with outros and other longish tracks',
> select an album and I see only the long tracks. But if I press the album
> play or queue buttons at the top, it queues all tracks from the album.

Then there's a bug. Thanks for the heads up!

> I don't quite see the purpose of the library view. Explain how this
> setting might be used.

I don't want kids music in my office. Therefore I'll use the "no kids
music" view as the default.

--

Michael
JJZolx
2014-06-12 06:48:42 UTC
Permalink
mherger wrote:
>
> > I don't quite see the purpose of the library view. Explain how this
> > setting might be used.
>
> I don't want kids music in my office. Therefore I'll use the "no kids
> music" view as the default.

I see. So the library view would then be applied to the normal browse
modes, correct? And 'Albums' would then be the sames 'Albums with outros
and other longish tracks'? If that's the case, then I'd expect the other
specialize menu items (browse modes) to not appear once a different view
is selected.


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Michael Herger
2014-06-12 07:14:50 UTC
Permalink
>>> I don't quite see the purpose of the library view. Explain how this
>>> setting might be used.
>>
>> I don't want kids music in my office. Therefore I'll use the "no kids
>> music" view as the default.
>
> I see. So the library view would then be applied to the normal browse
> modes, correct?

Correct.


> And 'Albums' would then be the sames 'Albums with outros
> and other longish tracks'? If that's the case, then I'd expect the other
> specialize menu items (browse modes) to not appear once a different view
> is selected.

That's totally up to the plugin developer. The LibraryDemo plugin is a
demo. It shows _some_ of the possibilities without making much sense.

--

Michael
lrossouw
2014-06-12 07:34:50 UTC
Permalink
mherger wrote:
>
>
> > I don't quite see the purpose of the library view. Explain how this
> > setting might be used.
>
> I don't want kids music in my office. Therefore I'll use the "no kids
> music" view as the default.
>

I guess part of it is the browsing (you won't see kids music when
browsing), though to me this is not as interesting as filtering out
kid's music, books, talks etc. when playing from shuffle, random play,
smartmix or similar.

Can the views be defined on volatile items such as play count or rating
from trackstat. These may change between scans? You mentioned that the
views are applied at scan time?

I might have an unlistened to music view. Or a >3 star rating view. Or
a not recently played view?

This should provide for an improvement on erland's custom skip plugin
also?



Louis
'Last.fm' (http://www.last.fm/user/lrossouw)
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bonze
2014-06-12 08:53:13 UTC
Permalink
OK - running on WHS 2011, v7.9.0, 1402499458
It just stops with nothing in the server.log

I tried running in "Safe Mode", but not sure what to make of the info in
the log file.

There are two oddities though:

Slim::Utils::PluginManager::_parseInstallManifest (744) plugin
ACLFiletest incompatible with system - disabling
Slim::Utils::PluginManager::_parseInstallManifest (752) ACLFiletest
[Slim::Plugin::ACLFiletest::Plugin] INSTALLERROR_INCOMPATIBLE_PLATFORM

and

Warning: [09:40:15.2524] DBIx::Class::Row::throw_exception(): Can't
locate Slim/Schema/LibraryTrack.pm in @INC (@INC contains:
C:\ProgramData\Squeezebox\Cache\InstalledPlugins
C:\PROGRA~2\SQUEEZ~1\server\CPAN\arch\5.14\MSWin32-x86-multi-thread
C:\PROGRA~2\SQUEEZ~1\server\CPAN\arch\5.14\MSWin32-x86-multi-thread\auto
C:\PROGRA~2\SQUEEZ~1\server\CPAN\arch\5.14.1\MSWin32-x86-multi-thread
C:\PROGRA~2\SQUEEZ~1\server\CPAN\arch\5.14.1\MSWin32-x86-multi-thread\auto
C:\PROGRA~2\SQUEEZ~1\server\CPAN\arch\5.14\MSWin32-x86-multi-thread
C:\PROGRA~2\SQUEEZ~1\server\CPAN\arch\5.14\MSWin32-x86-multi-thread\auto
C:\PROGRA~2\SQUEEZ~1\server\CPAN\arch\MSWin32-x86-multi-thread
C:\PROGRA~2\SQUEEZ~1\server\CPAN\arch\5.14
C:\PROGRA~2\SQUEEZ~1\server\lib C:\PROGRA~2\SQUEEZ~1\server\CPAN
C:/PROGRA~2/SQUEEZ~1/server C:/PROGRA~2/SQUEEZ~1/server
C:\Users\ADMINI~1\AppData\Local\Temp\2\pdk-Administrator-2872\
C:\PROGRA~2\SQUEEZ~1\server) at
/<C:\PROGRA~2\SQUEEZ~1\server\SQUEEZ~3.EXE>Class/C3/Componentised.pm
line 128.

Gone back to 7.9.0-1402412502.exe



LMS Version: 7.9
TranquilPC T2-WHS-A3 - WHS 2011
2x Touch, 3x SB3
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Michael Herger
2014-06-12 12:00:00 UTC
Permalink
> OK - running on WHS 2011, v7.9.0, 1402499458
> It just stops with nothing in the server.log

Could you please give the latest build another try? Should be fixed now.
Thanks!

--

Michael
bonze
2014-06-12 15:44:57 UTC
Permalink
mherger wrote:
> > OK - running on WHS 2011, v7.9.0, 1402499458
> > It just stops with nothing in the server.log
>
> Could you please give the latest build another try? Should be fixed now.
>
> Thanks!
>
> --
>
> MichaelRuns OK now - thankyou.



LMS Version: 7.9
TranquilPC T2-WHS-A3 - WHS 2011
2x Touch, 3x SB3
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Michael Herger
2014-06-12 10:14:21 UTC
Permalink
> I guess part of it is the browsing (you won't see kids music when
> browsing), though to me this is not as interesting as filtering out
> kid's music, books, talks etc. when playing from shuffle, random play,

Shuffle/random play should already respect the library setting.

> smartmix or similar.

There's work left to do :-).

> Can the views be defined on volatile items such as play count or rating
> from trackstat. These may change between scans? You mentioned that the
> views are applied at scan time?

By default yes, they're part of the scan. But nothing prevents a plugin
developer from triggering it on other occasions, schedule updates etc.
The three demo configurations take a fraction of a second to complete on
a library with a few thousand tracks. Depending on the complexity of
what you'd like to do a regular update might be absolutely feasible.

--

Michael
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